(no subject)
Mar. 21st, 2004 09:59 am![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
katallisonAhhh ... it's most pleasant to start Sunday off with a mimosa, made with leftover champagne from last night's festive dinner with P. We have an anniversary-of-sorts in late March, a moveable feast, and so we celebrated last night with champagne and pistachio-crusted sea bass (*marvellous*--recipe can be found here). And we had our usual dispute about just how long we've been together; neither of us can recall with certainty whether we hooked up in '92 or '93, so it's been either 11 or 12 years. Golly.
We were also sort-of-celebrating a sort-of-decision I may perhaps have made ...
OK, for a while now I've been contemplating replacing my current car, the pretty-reliable-but-very-boring '92 Plymouth Sundance with 133,000 miles on it that I got from my brother. I don't *need* to replace it; it's still running OK, the rust isn't too bad yet, I could likely squeeze another year or two out of it. But I really, really would like to have a car with a few modern conveniences like A/C and a CD player and cupholders. And which I can feel confident will not die suddenly, stranding me in a remote location on a wintry night.
So the plan had been to shop around and find a good, low-mileage used Civic, or maybe a Corolla. A nice, sensible car. And I have dutifully searched, setting good realistic practical criteria, and found that there's a lot of cars on the market that would fill the bill.
But lo, in the middle of my sensible, realistic, level-headed proceedings, I was blindsided. As has befallen so many others, my steady settling into pragmatic middle age was ripped asunder by the lightning-bolt of Passion. Before I knew what had happened, I was smitten, moonstruck, infatuated. My head was turned, my heart was captured, my common sense went out the window.
Yes, mortifying though it is to confess, I have fallen like a ton of bricks for the Mini Cooper.
This is *mortifying.* I feel like a sedate businessman with a passion for a chorus girl. I know all the reasons why indulging this sudden fit would be irrational, including:
--It's little and teeny and if I ever need to haul stuff, I'm SOL.
--It costs at least $5000 more than the hypothetical used Civic I could/should buy instead.
--There are a *lot* of other interesting, useful, or more significant things I could do with that $5000.
--A car is not an investment, it is a money hole. It will only depreciate in value.
--Buying a *new* car is particularly stupid, on account of the depreciation factor.
Apart from the irrationality, what's especially disturbing to me about this infatuation is that it forces me to revise one element of my Definition of Self, namely I am not someone who cares about cars. My philosophy has always been that a car is a by-god utility, a machine for getting you from one place to another, and the only thing that matters is that it do so dependably, efficiently and cheaply. Spending a penny on anything beyond those minimum criteria is not something I do.
Except. Ahem. I really, really want a Mini.
So I went and test-drove one yesterday; I've gotten preapproved financing (at 3.85%, not bad); I've discovered I could insure it at Geico for about the same as I'm paying State Farm to insure my clunky Plymouth (clearly State Farm's been grossly overcharging me for years now, dammit). I'm going to do another test-drive on Monday, and at that point I should make up my flippin' mind one way or ther other. Even if I closed the deal today, it would take two months for it to be delivered (that's how back-ordered they are), so I'd have plenty of time to wallow in Buyer's Remorse.
Anyway -- for the first time, I'm actually posting a dopey poll soliciting advice. (Let's see if this works...)
[Poll #266271]
We were also sort-of-celebrating a sort-of-decision I may perhaps have made ...
OK, for a while now I've been contemplating replacing my current car, the pretty-reliable-but-very-boring '92 Plymouth Sundance with 133,000 miles on it that I got from my brother. I don't *need* to replace it; it's still running OK, the rust isn't too bad yet, I could likely squeeze another year or two out of it. But I really, really would like to have a car with a few modern conveniences like A/C and a CD player and cupholders. And which I can feel confident will not die suddenly, stranding me in a remote location on a wintry night.
So the plan had been to shop around and find a good, low-mileage used Civic, or maybe a Corolla. A nice, sensible car. And I have dutifully searched, setting good realistic practical criteria, and found that there's a lot of cars on the market that would fill the bill.
But lo, in the middle of my sensible, realistic, level-headed proceedings, I was blindsided. As has befallen so many others, my steady settling into pragmatic middle age was ripped asunder by the lightning-bolt of Passion. Before I knew what had happened, I was smitten, moonstruck, infatuated. My head was turned, my heart was captured, my common sense went out the window.
Yes, mortifying though it is to confess, I have fallen like a ton of bricks for the Mini Cooper.
This is *mortifying.* I feel like a sedate businessman with a passion for a chorus girl. I know all the reasons why indulging this sudden fit would be irrational, including:
--It's little and teeny and if I ever need to haul stuff, I'm SOL.
--It costs at least $5000 more than the hypothetical used Civic I could/should buy instead.
--There are a *lot* of other interesting, useful, or more significant things I could do with that $5000.
--A car is not an investment, it is a money hole. It will only depreciate in value.
--Buying a *new* car is particularly stupid, on account of the depreciation factor.
Apart from the irrationality, what's especially disturbing to me about this infatuation is that it forces me to revise one element of my Definition of Self, namely I am not someone who cares about cars. My philosophy has always been that a car is a by-god utility, a machine for getting you from one place to another, and the only thing that matters is that it do so dependably, efficiently and cheaply. Spending a penny on anything beyond those minimum criteria is not something I do.
Except. Ahem. I really, really want a Mini.
So I went and test-drove one yesterday; I've gotten preapproved financing (at 3.85%, not bad); I've discovered I could insure it at Geico for about the same as I'm paying State Farm to insure my clunky Plymouth (clearly State Farm's been grossly overcharging me for years now, dammit). I'm going to do another test-drive on Monday, and at that point I should make up my flippin' mind one way or ther other. Even if I closed the deal today, it would take two months for it to be delivered (that's how back-ordered they are), so I'd have plenty of time to wallow in Buyer's Remorse.
Anyway -- for the first time, I'm actually posting a dopey poll soliciting advice. (Let's see if this works...)
[Poll #266271]
![[identity profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/openid.png){kind=small}
(no subject)
Date: 2004-03-21 09:16 am (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2004-03-21 10:04 am (UTC)Well, if I do go for the Mini, you'll get a ride in it at VividCon. (You *are* coming to VividCon, yes?)
(no subject)
Date: 2004-03-21 09:18 am (UTC)I can't buy one, so I can live vicariously through you. ::g::
But seriously? Buy the Mini.
(no subject)
Date: 2004-03-21 10:05 am (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2004-03-21 09:28 am (UTC)Seriously, go for it. You work hard, you deserve it.
(no subject)
Date: 2004-03-21 10:08 am (UTC)If I do buy it, you will absolutely and most definitely get rides in it, at least.
(no subject)
Date: 2004-03-21 09:30 am (UTC)So I'll just tell you the food sounds great. :)
(no subject)
Date: 2004-03-21 10:04 am (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2004-03-21 10:10 am (UTC)I just find it really embarrassing that what seems to be hitting my "live life to the fullest" and "do crazy things" button is a freakin' *car.* I mean, what am I, a middle-aged recently-divorced guy or something?? Arrgghhh.
(no subject)
Date: 2004-03-21 02:11 pm (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2004-03-21 09:37 am (UTC)You wouldn't be the first person I know who's succumbed to the lure of cup holders and other stuff new cars have. And my environmental theory of cars is buy them little, and drive them for two decades, or until they're dead, whichever comes first.
Oh, and when I checked, no one was selling mini Coopers used, so if you want one you have to buy new.
Am I helping?
(no subject)
Date: 2004-03-21 10:13 am (UTC)::nodding:: This is actually one thing I put on the "go for it!" side of the scale -- that (barring catastrophe) I'll keep this car until it dies. Which, given how little I drive in an average year (maybe 3000 miles, max) could be a good long time. I certainly would expect to still be driving this well into my 60s. So over time the difference in expense sort of amortizes itself out, I tell myself.
Oh, and I did see a couple of used ones locally, but they were actually priced above MSRP for a *new* one. Which seems weird; I guess there are people who'll pay a premium to get one without having to wait two months, or something. (This also assures me that if I do order one and then change my mind, or lose my job or something, I could probably unload it w/o taking much of a bath.)
Thanks for the helpful comments!
(no subject)
Date: 2004-03-21 11:27 am (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2004-03-21 09:50 am (UTC)One (very practical) question is how well would a Mini do in the snow? I know you generally walk to work, but you do also live in an area with a lot of snow, and there will be times you'll want to drive in it, no?
You could definitely get a *new* and practical car like a Saturn for the kind of money you're looking at spending on the Mini, so perhaps you ought to at least consider that--because I know from experience that it's very difficult to find late model used cars like Corollas and Civics and Saturns, because people tend to hold onto them until they have a lot of miles on them...
In any case, I send you hugs and wish you luck and fortitude in your search for the right vehicle :-)
(no subject)
Date: 2004-03-21 10:15 am (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2004-03-21 10:24 am (UTC)Anyway, I'm still doing the back-and-forth in my head, but as always, I really appreciate your thoughtful comments!
(no subject)
Date: 2004-03-21 09:57 am (UTC)The end.
(no subject)
Date: 2004-03-21 10:34 am (UTC)You know, that's the hell of it, it's exactly the car one can imagine oneself climbing into and driving off in to have Adventures. Which I think I could use some of, before middle age really gets its hands around my throat.
(no subject)
Date: 2004-03-21 10:09 am (UTC)Whimsy is good for the soul :)
(no subject)
Date: 2004-03-21 10:35 am (UTC)Anyway, someday I'll have to drive it out west and give you a ride around town in it!
(no subject)
Date: 2004-03-21 10:14 am (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2004-03-21 10:25 am (UTC)1) Coopers in climates like yours. Good? Bad? Disasterous?
2) Don't worry so much about depreciation as how long this one will last. You're not changeable, you'll keep a car you love forever if you can. How long is forever for a Mini?
3) Small cars...yeah they're not as safe in a crash, but how much bigger and sturdier a car could you afford? Most of them are made out of tinfoil and chewing gum anyway. So what's the safety rating on a Mini vs. anything else you might think to buy?
4) DO you WANT to buy someone else's troubles? Does your state have a lemon law of some sort that will protect your purchase, used or new?
5) Look into Geico's record. I've heard some questionable things about them, but it could just be the typical rumor mill stuff.
I voted eat dessert first partly because in the end you can research until your eyeballs drop out and can still end up with the breakdown-king-deathtrap. And you can buy on impulse and still get the best damn car ever. You just don't know. So in the end, I say do your research and then let your heart decide.
Good luck, kiddo.
Consumer Reports says:
Date: 2004-03-21 10:26 am (UTC)The ratings are Excellent / Very Good / Good / Fair / Poor
Mini Coopers rated "Poor" in reliability. Dead last of all possible ratings. That alone would make me look at other cars. Other than that, both "ride" and "noise" were rated only average.
Sensible is not necessarily boring. Go test-drive the Corollas and the Civics, and pick up this month's CR. You don't have to buy right now. Cars shouldn't be impulse purchases anyway. ;)
J
(no subject)
Date: 2004-03-21 10:28 am (UTC)I almost always regret things I purchase on impulse. I think that if you can make yourself wait (even four to six months or so) and you STILL want it then, that's a better sign of what the right thing to do is than listening to your "I want it, I want it, it's pretty, I want it" voice.
I do totally get the Mini lust, we think they're fabulous too.
(no subject)
Date: 2004-03-21 10:32 am (UTC)Other than that, if I could afford to keep a car in NYC, I would totally want it to be a Mini.
(no subject)
Date: 2004-03-21 10:34 am (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2004-03-21 10:38 am (UTC)I bought my first brand-new car in 1998 when Subaru came out with the Forester. They were grossly overpriced (a new, fully-loaded one has a lower MSRP *now* than my semi-loaded one did in 1998), but safe. Safe was a big deal to me due to being t-boned a few times in quick succession. I wanted to live in a steel cage. Anyway, I've since spilled coffee all over the inside and it smells funny and the bloom is definitely off, but it was totally worth it. New Car wasn't a status symbol for me, and it doesn't sound like it's one for you, either. It fits in your mental porte cochere, it's an aesthetic match for your eye, it's probably safer than your current car (despite its tiny size), and you apparently can afford it. You deserve to give yourself New Car!
The snow issue is glaring and tediously practical, but must be addressed. If you can drive the thing in snow, or if you can easily formulate an alternate plan, then that's no longer an issue.
It's a darling thing, the Mini. I have a bit of lust for it--I think everyone who sees it does, don't they? Just passing one parked, I hallucinate Pucci-dressed dolly birds frugging at its fenders...
(no subject)
Date: 2004-03-21 10:47 am (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2004-03-21 10:50 am (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2004-03-21 10:56 am (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2004-03-21 10:56 am (UTC)$5K sounds like a lot for an invisible value like happiness, but if you have a reasonable shot at keeping the car for 10 years, that works out to an extra $500 a year -- a mere $10/week -- for smiling every time you get in it, or see it parked in your garage.
I don't know in particular if the Mini is the model that you should go with -- the CR Reports are a little troubling, I'd check out the reviews on Cars.com for comparing and contrasting, and they have forums for the various brands and makes so you could take a peek in and see what the Actual Mini Owners are saying two and three years after they bought. But whatever you buy at whatever the price, I'd like to see it be something more than utilitarian ownership.
(no subject)
Date: 2004-03-21 11:20 am (UTC)I was placed in a situation just similar to this not too long ago -- needing to buy a car, and being torn between the sensible, few frills Plymouth Breeze or the brand spanking wonderfully new PT Cruiser that I'd had my heart set on for ages.
I got the Breeze. I love my Breeze. I love the fact that I have $7000 more now than I would have if I'd gotten the PT Cruiser. And, like the Mini, I'm starting to see Cruisers all over my town. NO ONE has a Breeze -- I've seen, like, one on a highway a month ago. I know the civic is a bit more mainstream of a model, but it's still not as obviously popular as a mini or cruiser (which anyone can tell at a glance)...so (and I think someone else brought up this point too) if whether or not a lot of people have your car model matters to you, it is a point of consideration.
I seem to be taking an unpopular opinion amongst most of your f-list who are all eat drink and be merry about the situation, but I say get your reliable used and do something *else* that will make you very happy with all the money you save on your purchase. :)
Hope you figure things out soon!
(no subject)
Date: 2004-03-21 11:25 am (UTC)Also, those things are very low to the ground and your visibility would be horrible in it. Get stuck behind an SUV and you won't be able to see anything at all in front of you besides that vehicle's license plate.
(no subject)
Date: 2004-03-21 11:28 am (UTC)And... it's kind of a myth these days, that little car=less safe. In a lot of cases, it's those big guzzly SUV's that do *poorly* in safety tests, while Civics and the like do very, very well.
(no subject)
Date: 2004-03-21 11:37 am (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2004-03-21 11:52 am (UTC)Just last year, I bought a new car. I'd never had the chance to buy a new one before, and so I thought I didn't care about cars. I learned better as soon as I realized I could, in fact, afford a new one. A nice one. One that would make me happy every time I got in it, because it was comfortable and aesthetically pleasing to me and was What I Wanted as well as What I Could Afford.
I did a lot of research before I let myself settle on anything, though. I was in love with the Saturn VUE, but it turned out not to be as perfect for me as I thought, for various reasons. Instead, I got a GMC Envoy, which I love, love, love. So my vote is, get something that moves your soul as well as your body, but make sure it really suits you before putting any money down.
Also, check around for insurance. I've known five people who had Geico when they got in accidents, and all five of them had to fight tooth and nail to get any money out of the company.
(no subject)
Date: 2004-03-21 11:57 am (UTC)I speak from experience. My first not-owned-by-anybody-in-the-family car was a piece of crap Ford Escort. After a few years of crap, my folks sold the escort, kept the $$, and gave me their 83 Subaru wagon when they bought a newer car. One interesting thing about the 81-83 subs -- when they reach a certain age, the clutch cable breaks about once a year. Talk about annoying. I want a car that, if I suddenly decide to drive down to LA, I can without worrying about it.
And y'know? My 49 year old brother bought a used red Miata last year. We STILL give him crap about it. :-> I didn't get a chance to see it when I was in Spokane last December because they have to put it in storage for the winter. I mean, what good is that?
(no subject)
Date: 2004-03-21 12:14 pm (UTC)Environmentally speaking, small cars are defly better, especially if you're buying new - less of the toxic materials needed to make them (tho creating a new car always has a pretty high environmental impact these days). I did briefly think about a Mini, cuz they are very cute, but I really wanted a hybrid (and I'll happily sing the praises of hybrids if you're interested, tho I won't be able to speak to the snow-driving issue).
That said, the Consumer Reports rating for reliability is very troubling. That doesn't sound like a car you'll still be driving at 60. I'm all for "you're worth spending $5000 for something that will make you happy," but a car which needs lots of repairs over time will seriously take away from that happiness.
(no subject)
Date: 2004-03-21 01:02 pm (UTC)Go for the Mini.
(no subject)
Date: 2004-03-21 01:02 pm (UTC)Good Luck with your choice!
As your friends, we suck at giving practical advice.
Date: 2004-03-21 02:43 pm (UTC)But alas, I vote for the mini, if only becasue I can't justify advising you to be practical, environmentally sound and refuse to give in to rampant consumerism, when I myself am lusting for a new, soft top, black Jeep Wrangler with leather seats...
(no subject)
Date: 2004-03-21 04:55 pm (UTC)As deeply and as strongly as I fall in love with cars, I was only in love with the Mini for about six months. Cute as hell on the street, but the ride and the noise just turned me off. And I wouldn't trust one in a Chicago winter, much less a Minnesota winter.
That said? Follow your heart. Because ultimately something that gives you joy is worth more than all the practicality in the world.
So familiar...
Date: 2004-03-21 05:28 pm (UTC)I'm not a car girl; cars are useful tools, ya know, and that's all. Practically, if I possibly can, I'll buy a hybrid next. And I've heard rumors of a hybrid Mini in the works. If my little '89 Mazda 323 can last until they become available, I'll wait for the best of both worlds.
May you enjoy whatever choice you make!
(no subject)
Date: 2004-03-21 06:56 pm (UTC)My father thinks that English engines are horrible, small cars are very dangerous, and *new* cars are an obscene waste of money.
What I would suggest is if you're willing to spend an extra $5000 for the Mini, why don't you look at used cars in that increased price range? You might just find something amazing (a '99 Mercedes for example).
I mean, I'm biased because I have a terror of driving a new car -- I have this terrible aptitude for scratching and denting any vehicle I drive.
Chiming in. :)
Date: 2004-03-21 07:08 pm (UTC)I personally think the minis are ugly, but hey, you gotta get what makes you happy! The bad rating would give me pause, though. Jim says they're . . . dunno if I got this right . . . branded by BMW, but actually made by Rover -- like, Land Rover? Bad sign.
I put money down on a Toyota Prius five months ago and desperately wanted one, but I want one less and less as the likelihood of ever getting the color and options I want seems more distant. :P Damned if I'll wait for months for a brand new car and not get what I want.
I've always REALLY wanted . . . an SUV. I'm currently leaning strongly to a Toyota Rav 4 (I'm Toyota brand loyal big time), even though the gas mileage isn't great. It doesn't cost any more than the Prius or a basic sedan of almost any stripe. Space! The final frontier!
(no subject)
Date: 2004-03-22 09:33 am (UTC)Words from the older (if not wiser) Nancy in SF
Namaste !